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	<title>Comments on: Groupthink and the med con</title>
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		<title>By: Ed Morrison</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3345</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Morrison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 15:09:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3345</guid>
		<description>Susan: 

Keep pushing. I have no clue, but I have been suspicious not only of the lack of a vote, but also of the selection process (there was none that I remember) for MMPI. 

Some smart lawyers undoubtedly read BFD, but Cleveland, in my view, is dominated by either a fear of reprisals or an Alfred E. Neuman &quot;What Me Worry?&quot; syndrome. Few of these folks will likely stick their head up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Susan: </p>
<p>Keep pushing. I have no clue, but I have been suspicious not only of the lack of a vote, but also of the selection process (there was none that I remember) for MMPI. </p>
<p>Some smart lawyers undoubtedly read BFD, but Cleveland, in my view, is dominated by either a fear of reprisals or an Alfred E. Neuman &#8220;What Me Worry?&#8221; syndrome. Few of these folks will likely stick their head up.</p>
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		<title>By: Susan Miller</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3344</link>
		<dc:creator>Susan Miller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 12:08:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3344</guid>
		<description>Look, they raised the tax for a convention center which should have gone before the electorate according to my reading of the ORC. Who provides the opinion, Cordray or Brunner? I&#039;ll just make the calls and find out if you guys don&#039;t know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Look, they raised the tax for a convention center which should have gone before the electorate according to my reading of the ORC. Who provides the opinion, Cordray or Brunner? I&#8217;ll just make the calls and find out if you guys don&#8217;t know.</p>
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		<title>By: John Ettorre</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3343</link>
		<dc:creator>John Ettorre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 10:53:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3343</guid>
		<description>Interestingly enough, it turns out it was enacted by the legislature way back in 1993 (thanks for that link, Susan). Which, if memory serves, happens to be just one year before Mr. Polk got unceremoniously ousted from his perch at COSE.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interestingly enough, it turns out it was enacted by the legislature way back in 1993 (thanks for that link, Susan). Which, if memory serves, happens to be just one year before Mr. Polk got unceremoniously ousted from his perch at COSE.</p>
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		<title>By: John Polk</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3342</link>
		<dc:creator>John Polk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 04:42:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3342</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m somewhat removed from the legislative process these days, but I suspect a little research would demonstrate that the loophole was opened, very quietly, by the former Convention Facilities Authority as a late-night amendment to a state capital budget somewhere around 2003 or 2004.  The sponsor was probably a downstate Republican. Not a lot of those in the NEO delegation back then. And you&#039;d need the majority to enact such an amendment without a hearing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m somewhat removed from the legislative process these days, but I suspect a little research would demonstrate that the loophole was opened, very quietly, by the former Convention Facilities Authority as a late-night amendment to a state capital budget somewhere around 2003 or 2004.  The sponsor was probably a downstate Republican. Not a lot of those in the NEO delegation back then. And you&#8217;d need the majority to enact such an amendment without a hearing.</p>
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		<title>By: Susan Miller</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3341</link>
		<dc:creator>Susan Miller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 04:27:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3341</guid>
		<description>Carla,
Let&#039;s ask for the opinion. I&#039;ve been wondering this since we were collecting signatures two summers ago.

Both posts address the &quot;loophole&quot;. http://realneo.us/content/meaningless-public-meeting-medical-mart
and 
http://realneo.us/content/frank-jackson-has-concerns#comment-9211


Isn&#039;t there a practicing lawyer on the BOCC?

Would we be asking for an opinion of the Attorney General on this enactment of a section of the ORC or would we be addressing the non-election issue to the Secretary of State? Come on guys, you&#039;re smart. I am just a dumb dance company director who emerged from a quarter century in studios and theaters to shock and awe.

(Tried to ask this question earlier today, but apparently it didn&#039;t post...Thank you, Mr. Polk for restating what I have been asking since the summer of 2007. I was sounding like a broken record to myself.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carla,<br />
Let&#8217;s ask for the opinion. I&#8217;ve been wondering this since we were collecting signatures two summers ago.</p>
<p>Both posts address the &#8220;loophole&#8221;. <a href="http://realneo.us/content/meaningless-public-meeting-medical-mart" >http://realneo.us/content/meaningless-public-meeting-medical-mart</a><br />
and<br />
<a href="http://realneo.us/content/frank-jackson-has-concerns#comment-9211" >http://realneo.us/content/frank-jackson-has-concerns#comment-9211</a></p>
<p>Isn&#8217;t there a practicing lawyer on the BOCC?</p>
<p>Would we be asking for an opinion of the Attorney General on this enactment of a section of the ORC or would we be addressing the non-election issue to the Secretary of State? Come on guys, you&#8217;re smart. I am just a dumb dance company director who emerged from a quarter century in studios and theaters to shock and awe.</p>
<p>(Tried to ask this question earlier today, but apparently it didn&#8217;t post&#8230;Thank you, Mr. Polk for restating what I have been asking since the summer of 2007. I was sounding like a broken record to myself.)</p>
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		<title>By: Carla Rautenberg</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3340</link>
		<dc:creator>Carla Rautenberg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 02:58:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3340</guid>
		<description>For sure, J.Ettorre, &quot;that damn loophole ought to be closed.&quot; Jennifer Brunner? Before you&#039;re TOO busy with the race for U.S. Senate, how about taking on this wee matter of restoring the constitutional rights of the citizens of Cuyahoga County? It could make you mighty popular up here in NEO.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For sure, J.Ettorre, &#8220;that damn loophole ought to be closed.&#8221; Jennifer Brunner? Before you&#8217;re TOO busy with the race for U.S. Senate, how about taking on this wee matter of restoring the constitutional rights of the citizens of Cuyahoga County? It could make you mighty popular up here in NEO.</p>
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		<title>By: John Ettorre</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3339</link>
		<dc:creator>John Ettorre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 01:29:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3339</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s generally been described as a loophole in the state law which permitted the commissioners to raise that tax without first putting it to a vote of the public. If so, that damn loophole ought to be closed right quick. After his latest comment here, I think one can see fairly clearly why Mr. Polk stood out so prominently in the Cleveland business leadership during his time running COSE. His ability to courageously cut through the bull and call things what they really are was as refreshing as it ultimately proved to be unwelcomed in some quarters.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s generally been described as a loophole in the state law which permitted the commissioners to raise that tax without first putting it to a vote of the public. If so, that damn loophole ought to be closed right quick. After his latest comment here, I think one can see fairly clearly why Mr. Polk stood out so prominently in the Cleveland business leadership during his time running COSE. His ability to courageously cut through the bull and call things what they really are was as refreshing as it ultimately proved to be unwelcomed in some quarters.</p>
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		<title>By: Carla Rautenberg</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3338</link>
		<dc:creator>Carla Rautenberg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 23:32:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3338</guid>
		<description>WOW. Calling all lawyers! John Polk asks &quot;Has the legislation which enabled the Commissioners to raise the sales tax without a vote been tested for constitutionality?&quot; What a great question.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WOW. Calling all lawyers! John Polk asks &#8220;Has the legislation which enabled the Commissioners to raise the sales tax without a vote been tested for constitutionality?&#8221; What a great question.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark W. "Some Guy on Bridge" Schumann</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3337</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark W. "Some Guy on Bridge" Schumann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 23:09:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3337</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;One of the benefits to The Imperial Bureaucracy of the byzantine structure of the so-called economic development organization process is that the complexity tends to shelter ALL the players from much accountability.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

One way to cut through all the complexity is to oust Hagan and Dimora, at least. If the scam is somehow not really their fault, although I can&#039;t imagine how that&#039;s possible, they&#039;ll squeal before it costs them their Commision seats.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>One of the benefits to The Imperial Bureaucracy of the byzantine structure of the so-called economic development organization process is that the complexity tends to shelter ALL the players from much accountability.</p></blockquote>
<p>One way to cut through all the complexity is to oust Hagan and Dimora, at least. If the scam is somehow not really their fault, although I can&#8217;t imagine how that&#8217;s possible, they&#8217;ll squeal before it costs them their Commision seats.</p>
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		<title>By: John Polk</title>
		<link>http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/2009/groupthink-and-the-med-con/comment-page-1#comment-3335</link>
		<dc:creator>John Polk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 19:48:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brewedfreshdaily.com/?p=1195#comment-3335</guid>
		<description>When you&#039;re running a scam, speed is very important.  If the mark has time to think, you run the risk of blowing it.

Thus far, this particular scam hasn&#039;t worked all that well.  So the principals are falling back on their power to preclude discussion.

The significant decline in large meeting activity has been a readily-observable phenomenon for most of the past decade, especially since 9/11/01.  Everybody knows meetings are down. Everybody knows that convention centers in non-Sun Belt communities are large net money losers.  Everybody knows the likelihood is high that the currently contemplated complex will be unlikely to rise above national trends.  But to those within The Matrix, the data don&#039;t matter, and the facts don&#039;t matter.  Only the deal matters.

Once again, I think we can get a cramp from thinking any of this makes sense in the logical, linear way regular people tend to think.  The proponents are saying whatever they need to say at any given time to keep things moving.

In general, the dodge you get from the self-anointed insiders is, &quot;If you only knew how incredibly complex and painful the process is, you&#039;d really appreciate how hard we&#039;re all working.  Believe me, you shouldn&#039;t worry your little head.&quot;  Loosely translated, that means, &quot;We&#039;re smarter than you, so sit down and shut up.&quot;

The answer to the ownership question would very likely depend on whom you ask.  If you ask MMPI, the answer will be, &quot;Because that&#039;s the deal we were offered, and given what we know about the industry and the market, it&#039;s the only way we can make any money.&quot;

As far as I can tell, the only folks who technically owe the public answers are the Commissioners.  But they&#039;re not writing the script.

The Commissioners DO nominally employ Fred Nance to negotiate the deal on their (our?) behalf, so he&#039;d be a good guy to ask.  And given that he played a similar role regarding Cleveland Browns Stadium as Mike White&#039;s personal lawyer, he probably has the answers.  But he&#039;s being paid with private dollars.  If you&#039;re the Chairman (or immediate past Chairman) of the private sector group, but representing the public sector in the discussion, BUT being paid with private dollars, is your work a matter of public record (I believe much of the Browns Stadium documentation was marked &quot;confidential work product&quot;)?

Mr. Nance and the CEO of GCP reportedly did most of the negotiating with MMPI.  But, as we have established, even in matters regarding public expenditures, the GCP is a private organization and owes the public nothing.

Positively Cleveland, which has been notably silent on the matter, does receive a big chunk of its funding from the public sector (and if press reports are accurate, may be liable for a big haircut if the County decides to divert bed tax dollars to the project).  But given their non-involvement in the matter (kind of odd for the convention and visitors bureau), I&#039;m not sure they&#039;d have any answers, even if they were inclined to come out of their hidey-hole and talk about it.

One of the benefits to The Imperial Bureaucracy of the byzantine structure of the so-called economic development organization process is that the complexity tends to shelter ALL the players from much accountability. It&#039;s much easier for all the guys to hide, talk only with one another, and give each other awards if nobody knows exactly what they&#039;re supposed to be doing.  And in the absence of metrics, nobody will know whether you&#039;re doing your job or not, WHATEVER it is.  In Cleveland&#039;s Economic Development Matrix, you&#039;re successful because you say you are, and because you can f--k with anyone who says differently.

It strikes me that, in all the chaos surrounding this particular (to use the Kennedy-esque) scheme, one question has eluded me till I read this post: Has the legislation which enabled the Commissioners to raise the sales tax without a vote been tested for constitutionality?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When you&#8217;re running a scam, speed is very important.  If the mark has time to think, you run the risk of blowing it.</p>
<p>Thus far, this particular scam hasn&#8217;t worked all that well.  So the principals are falling back on their power to preclude discussion.</p>
<p>The significant decline in large meeting activity has been a readily-observable phenomenon for most of the past decade, especially since 9/11/01.  Everybody knows meetings are down. Everybody knows that convention centers in non-Sun Belt communities are large net money losers.  Everybody knows the likelihood is high that the currently contemplated complex will be unlikely to rise above national trends.  But to those within The Matrix, the data don&#8217;t matter, and the facts don&#8217;t matter.  Only the deal matters.</p>
<p>Once again, I think we can get a cramp from thinking any of this makes sense in the logical, linear way regular people tend to think.  The proponents are saying whatever they need to say at any given time to keep things moving.</p>
<p>In general, the dodge you get from the self-anointed insiders is, &#8220;If you only knew how incredibly complex and painful the process is, you&#8217;d really appreciate how hard we&#8217;re all working.  Believe me, you shouldn&#8217;t worry your little head.&#8221;  Loosely translated, that means, &#8220;We&#8217;re smarter than you, so sit down and shut up.&#8221;</p>
<p>The answer to the ownership question would very likely depend on whom you ask.  If you ask MMPI, the answer will be, &#8220;Because that&#8217;s the deal we were offered, and given what we know about the industry and the market, it&#8217;s the only way we can make any money.&#8221;</p>
<p>As far as I can tell, the only folks who technically owe the public answers are the Commissioners.  But they&#8217;re not writing the script.</p>
<p>The Commissioners DO nominally employ Fred Nance to negotiate the deal on their (our?) behalf, so he&#8217;d be a good guy to ask.  And given that he played a similar role regarding Cleveland Browns Stadium as Mike White&#8217;s personal lawyer, he probably has the answers.  But he&#8217;s being paid with private dollars.  If you&#8217;re the Chairman (or immediate past Chairman) of the private sector group, but representing the public sector in the discussion, BUT being paid with private dollars, is your work a matter of public record (I believe much of the Browns Stadium documentation was marked &#8220;confidential work product&#8221;)?</p>
<p>Mr. Nance and the CEO of GCP reportedly did most of the negotiating with MMPI.  But, as we have established, even in matters regarding public expenditures, the GCP is a private organization and owes the public nothing.</p>
<p>Positively Cleveland, which has been notably silent on the matter, does receive a big chunk of its funding from the public sector (and if press reports are accurate, may be liable for a big haircut if the County decides to divert bed tax dollars to the project).  But given their non-involvement in the matter (kind of odd for the convention and visitors bureau), I&#8217;m not sure they&#8217;d have any answers, even if they were inclined to come out of their hidey-hole and talk about it.</p>
<p>One of the benefits to The Imperial Bureaucracy of the byzantine structure of the so-called economic development organization process is that the complexity tends to shelter ALL the players from much accountability. It&#8217;s much easier for all the guys to hide, talk only with one another, and give each other awards if nobody knows exactly what they&#8217;re supposed to be doing.  And in the absence of metrics, nobody will know whether you&#8217;re doing your job or not, WHATEVER it is.  In Cleveland&#8217;s Economic Development Matrix, you&#8217;re successful because you say you are, and because you can f&#8211;k with anyone who says differently.</p>
<p>It strikes me that, in all the chaos surrounding this particular (to use the Kennedy-esque) scheme, one question has eluded me till I read this post: Has the legislation which enabled the Commissioners to raise the sales tax without a vote been tested for constitutionality?</p>
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